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2002-01-24 Planning Comm MinutesPlanning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 CITY OF MENDOTA HEIGHTS DAKOTA COUNTY, MINNESOTA PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES (Continued from January 22, 2002) JANUARY 24, 2002 This is a continuation of the regular meeting of the Mendota Heights Planning Commission which was held on Tuesday, January 22, 2002 in the Council Chambers at City Hall, 1101 Victoria Curve. The January 24, 2002 meeting was called to order at 7:00 p.m. The following Commissioners were present: Chair Lorberbaum and Commissioners Betlej, B. McManus, Hesse, and M. McManus. City Staff present were Public Works Director Jim Danielson, City Attorney Tom Hart, and Administrative Assistant Patrick C. Hollister. Also present was Planner Steve Grittman of NAC. Minutes were recorded by Becki Shaffer. Transcripts were also taken by a court reporter to take proceedings verbatim. Excused: Commissioner Dolan Commission Friel Chair Lorberbaum stated the public hearing was still open. Presentations Mr. Roger Conant, Power Line Task Force Mr. Conant gave a brief description on his background. He commented that there are tapes available for the Commission. Mr. Conant referred to the California Study, which was distributed to the Commission. The California Project was authorized by the California PUC, funded by the Utilities Industry, cost $7M, and took three to four years to conduct. It was conducted by the Department of Public Health Sciences and is now complete. The results have been submitted in draft form because there is no public common period. The following are some of the findings of that study. The California Study talks about associations, which is an epidemiological logical concept and it talks about causation, which is a biological concept. When it comes to causation, the major findings of the study, which are on page 13, is that magnetic fields likely cause childhood leukemia, adult brain cancer, spontaneous abortion and ALS (Lou Gehrigs Disease). Magnetic fields possibly cause childhood brain cancer, female and breast cancer, Alzheimers Disease, Suicide, and heart problems. 1 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 Mr. Conant showed a diagram, which showed that for each of these diseases, they also assigned a probability that it was caused by magnetic field. The Department of Public Health scientists said that they thought there was less than 10% probability that magnetic fields cause these diseases. After they completed the studies, they concluded that between 60% and 95% probability that magnetic fields cause their diseases. For spontaneous abortions, momentary exposure above 16 mG. The remaining diseases, average exposure is between 2 to 4 and 12 mG, depending on the disease. In terms of the strengths of association, they concluded that the probability that childhood leukemia is associated with magnetic fields is 0.0004, in other words, there is a 0.0004 probability that this association, which they see, is wrong. This is statistical certainty. Similarly with adult brain cancer. For breast cancer, they found a 0.7% probability that the association that they see is due to chance. Normally, you would say that you would need a 0.5% probability to say there is a statistical significance. They stated that breast cancer is on the edge of being statistically significant, but it's not. Miscarriages they have a 0.3% probability that the association they see is due to chance. The other diseases are lower in probability, which is one of the reasons they are not as confident with the other diseases as with cancer and leukemia, that they in fact are caused by magnetic fields. Some people say that incidences of these diseases is so rare, childhood leukemia for example, so that there is double the chances that you are going to cause it through magnetic fields, says who cares because it's a rare disease to begin with. The California Study disagrees with that in its entirety. It said that because of magnetic fields, it is probable that in each year in California, there are 1, 148 deaths due to magnetic fields, and an additional 24,000 miscarriages. Translated to Minnesota, that would be mean 135 deaths and 2,800 miscarriages are attributed to EMF. The California Study goes on to point out that this is far higher degrees of disease and death than are associated with substances that are heavily regulated. The California Study concludes that this is not a minor problem, and that those who say that it should be ignored because of the diseases themselves don't incur so often are simply wrong. As a caveat, not all magnetic fields are coming from power lines. The California Study also examines of issue of magnetistic study. It knows that some critics say it is now shown how the magnetic fields cause these diseases. Dr. Martin Black appeared before the Steering Committee on March 22nd and talked in detail about how magnetic fields disrupt DNA and about how magnetic fields stress cells so that they emit unusual proteins, thereby disrupting the cell's functioning. It does appear there are magnetisms available, but even if there aren't, the California EMF project says "the demand that experimental magnetistic effects be detectable at residential levels of exposure is a stringent requirement that many recognized pathologists would not be able to meet ". The California Department of Health concludes that magnetic fields are associated with serious diseases. 2 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 Mr. Conant commented on the Childhood Leukemia Study. The UKCCS Study, which was done by Nicholas Day, is one of the studies that were overturned in the Ahlborm British Journal Study. Nicholas Day is one of the co- authors of the study, re- examined his own data, and determined he was wrong. A relationship should have been found. Mr. Conant quoted on several other studies. He added that in Europe, it is rare for exposure as in most European countries; they do not allow power lines to be built particularly near homes. In England, there is a prohibition against building power lines near homes. Europe runs as a higher voltage, 240 volts. Because of this, they use lower amps on average. Lower amperage means there are lower magnetic fields. Mr. Conant stated that when these studies are reviewed, one finds that they do in fact support that there is a relationship between magnetic fields and serious diseases. Mr. Conant referred to a handout given to the Commission; a document entitled "Issues Raised for the Planning Commission Meeting ". One of the questions was "Who would pay if the line were buried ?" Computations that presumable have to be borne by the City Mr. Conant supplied a copy of Xcel Energy's Compliance Submission in regards to Docket No. E- 002 -799, dated December 31, 2001 signed by James Johnson, Assistant General Counsel of Xcel. Mr. Conant referred to Page 8 of the document regarding Special Facility Costs. He stated that this means Xcel's definition of something that is above what they normally are required to do. Distribution undergrounding projects he believes means are normally going to be paid for by the community that orders them. What Xcel is saying in this document is that if the city orders the transmission lines to be buried, and if that transmission line is deemed to be a Special Facility, Xcel would then file a miscellaneous rate filing and the city would have an opportunity participate in that order of PUC. There has never been such a filing; the PUC has no policy regarding who would pay for the burial of transmission lines. A case could be made that the city can order the lines to be buried on health grounds, this would be a standard facility because standard facilities are those that are deemed necessary in order to preserve safety and health. As far as the PUC is concerned, this matter will be decided by the PUC who is going to pay the cost. That is Xcel's wordage. In the threatening tone they've adopted in their letter to the Commission is entirely consistent with their presentations before the PUC, of which Mr. Conant attended many and testified for hours. The segregation between transmission lines and distribution lines is due to findings the task force has made. Xcel characterizes this line as a "rebuild ". It is not however, doing so consistently. In its suit in front of Mendota Heights, its attorney's assistant referred this to a new line. The task force sees it as a new line and they feel it should be evaluated as a new line on the grounds that if this were a factory rather than a power line, and was a polluting factory, and the owner has torn down the factory to build a new one on the same site, that factory would be called a new line and would have to adhere to the standards then existing irrespective as to whether the line was grandfathered or not. Xcel has contended that this issue has been sited by EQB, the PUC, or the Minnesota Department of Health. It is fact that EQB exquisitely intended this issue to be decided by the cities and recognized with the words "if they approve the permit, that the cities might reject the permit in 3 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 its entirety ". The PUC did not rule on the present line and reviewed on an issue to remove the present line. While the PUC didn't order the line to be removed, they considered the issue doubtful enough that it is engaged in a task force to examine the issue and they invited the PLP to come back if the circumstances were changed. Xcel contended that the Metropolitan Airports Commission would pay the full cost of burying the line in Bloomington. The Commission received a packet with a copy of the agenda from the City of Bloomington. In the agenda, it showed that MAC would pay $1.1M, the city would pay $667,000, and Xcel would pay an estimated $953,000. It's a fact that Xcel is going to pay for burying the lines. Mr. Conant stated in regards to the cost of burying the line, the figures of $6.5M. He pointed out utilities have a terrible record of estimating the cost of burying the line particularly when they don't want to bury it. They tend to overestimate the cost. In Sandy, UT, the cost was estimated at $18M, the actual cost was $400,000. Here, the cost of burying the lines with the light rail system was estimated $27M, according to the paper; the consultant said it would be $2.6M. Mr. Conant discussed the Colliers Towle Study. He pointed out that Xcel has the ability to throttle down the line if they want. The question is "why would the current grow much at all ?" He stated Xcel's justification for building this line to begin with, as presented in Volume One in the CAI report, said that the new line is needed in the main because of developing energy needs in Wamnet and Lone Oaks and developing needs in Bloomington. Wamnet is practically bankrupt; it's not going to be using much more energy. The link from here to Bloomington is dead for the interminable future. The question asked if we need growth at all in the power going through the lines. It was asserted in the study that the reason CAI examined only lines terminating in Roger's Lake was because that was CAI's choice. That information is incorrect. The steering committee asked CAI to consider alternatives that did not terminate in Roger's Lake. CAI said that it could not do so because the additional work was not included in the budget. It was Xcel that set the budget, and who's paying the money. Therefore, by not providing more funds, it stopped CAI for expanding the scope of its work. Xcel maintained that the new line is not subject to the provisions of the Power Plan Siteing Act. This Act says that a line that is more than 100 kV, and more than 10 miles long, must be attain from the PUC a Certificate of Need. The period for obtaining such certificates for construction to take place in 2002 is now closed. Xcel states the project is 14.7 miles long. Phase I is defined to go from the Stockyards to Roger's Lake. Phase II goes from Roger's Lake to Bloomington. They applied for some of the work in Bloomington before they applied to South St. Paul. They applied for all of the work in Bloomington before they applied in Sunfish Lake. In the main applications on Phase I have occurred after applications in Phase II. Regarding St. Croix Falls and Taylors Falls, Mr. Conant mentioned that more information was not available from Xcel on where that line would go. Mr. Conant recently received a letter from David Callahan, which address two issues. Mr. Conant reviewed a map of the proposed lines in that area. He stated that the line is buried throughout both cities, and it continues in areas, which 4 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 are largely outside of the National Scenic Waterway. It is not correct to say that this line is being buried because it is required to because of the National Scenic Waterway. Xcel notes that there is not a standard for EMF for building lines and that's true. There soon will be. One of the purposes of the California project is precisely to establish standards. It is very unusual for power lines to be built this close to people. Only .002% of metro area household lies within 50 feet of power lines. Of those, 73% lie on the southeast metro line. Xcel requires 75 feet of right of way for new lines. Mr. Callahan maintains in the letter given to the Commission that there are some lines in urban areas that require only 50 feet. Since this information was received an hour before the meeting, Mr. Conant did not have the time to evaluate. Mr. Conant referred tables showing houses near the line, there are 208 of them. Xcel's chart shows in the metro areas, which houses are within 50 feet of lines. That is what the .002% is based on. It's only the last couple of years that dangers from magnetic power lines have become widely accepted by the relative scientific community. The question was raised about burying power lines eliminating the magnetic fields. Mr. Conant referred to a table that showed burying the line does eliminate the fields. In the letter from the Department of Transportation says that it is possible to build a line along I -494. David Herridge, 514 Huber Drive, Mendota Heights Mr. Herridge is an engineer and commented on EMF measures that were taken in his home as well as other homes in the area. In 1999, Ms. Dana Lowens provided a memo stating where the growth was along the line. The load growth of the Bloomington substation predicted over the next 14 years a growth of 97 %; Lone Oak is 51 %; Roger's Lake 38 %. He referred to an estimated EMF provided by Xcel. Looking at a home that's 25 feet from the line, there are some in Mendota Heights. The reading of EMF is around 30 mG. Mr. Herridge referred to a chart prepared by Xcel that showed after the line goes in, EMF is cut in half. It is important to recognize that this was only for the loads in 2001. In 2002 and 2003, the loads climb. As the loads grow over time, residents 25 feet from the line with the new line in place, will be experience 100 mG. exposures over the lifetime of the line. Mr. Herridge provided EMF ratings taken from his home, and other homes in his area. He recommends that people have their homes monitored and learn to understand the effects of EMF. He stated that there are five right -of -ways in Mendota Heights, and all of them have power lines on them. Xcel always draws the right -of -ways on the South as a single line, but in fact, it is a double line, and the way it is run, exposes more people to EMF than if the line was double circuited, and don't have benefit of cancellation. Mr. Herridge stated that if the power line running east west is improved, it's only going to consolidate the use of the Roger's Lake substation for a crossroads for electrical power. The 5 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 powerlines to the south will be the next to go, and everyone will be back at discussions again in a few years. Mr. Herridge feels this is a unique opportunity to look at the big picture and to deny CUP, and ask Xcel to balance the needs of the community, and to reduce the number of right -of- ways that are running across the community, while providing service. Mr. Conant commented on property values. The task force provided information from some capital appraisers that suggest the people that people who maintain the MLS listing feel that there will be an impact on property values and they also feel that Colliers Towle study was defective. Several academic studies show property values impacted by up to 14% in some cases, and 10% in others. Mrs. Ingrid Conant presented some feedback from the local real estate community. She checked with realtors (Edina Realty [2 realtors], Grand Avenue; Edina Realty, West St. Paul; Coldwell Banker Burnett, White Bear Lake), and all four said that there would be adverse impacts on property values. When they show homes that are close to transmission lines, such as those on Mendakota Court, they always mention the lines to avoid any future lawsuits. She gave an example of a realtor making a sale on a home, and papers were being prepared and ready for the final signing. There was a home close to transmissions lines in Hastings and when the realtor read the literature, at the last minute he withdrew because he did not want to impose the family to the health risks of EMF. Also, the new poles, made of galvanized steel, are not aesthetic to look at. Chair Lorberbaum stated an option available is to have the poles be painted. Mrs. Conant stated Xcel does not do that anymore because of additional costs. Commissioner Betlej asked if the house was ever sold. Mrs. Conant replied she didn't know. She added that the house next to her was empty for a long time, and evidentually torn down because no one wanted to buy close to the wires. Chair Lorberbaum stated this was in reference to the old lines. She would like to know what, if any, impact would come from the new proposed lines. Michael Sisken and Tammy Will, along with young daughter Sara. They reside at 788 Hokah Street, in which the home is within 50 feet of the line. The reading of EMF in their home is as high as 35mG. (California Study suggests 16mG is the point that leads to sharp increase in miscarriages). Ms. Will is currently pregnant. They moved to the area in search of a safer environment to raise their family. Ms. Will is concerned about EMF and the effects on her family. Ms. Will has several relatives afflicted with cancer, and Mr. Sisken has cancer, but has been in remission for six years. Ms. Wills' pediatrician agreed that there is concern, and have had several other parents who live near power lines express their concerns. She feels Xcel is making them sick, and Xcel does not seem to care about health concerns. The lines run along the back yard, closest to the master bedroom. Since her pregnancy, they moved into the guest room across the hall for fear of miscarriage. She also avoids the living room. She will not allow her daughter to play in the back yard anymore. Ms. Wills then became visibly upset and could not continue. Her husband, Mr. Sisken, took the floor and stated that he and Ms. Wills ask that the request for the upgrade be denied. He wants some options that do not put health in danger or 6 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 affect their property values. They cannot live in this house. Why should anyone have to choose between a home that can cause life threatening diseases, and a home that doesn't. In order to see the line in their back yard, one must go to the window and look directly up. It's very close. They don't mind the ugly lines so much, but it is the health issue that has them concerned. The previous owner of the house died from brain cancer. Mr. Sisken also feels disheartened by reading in the paper, stories of the tactics Xcel has taken in other communities. They seem to have their way regardless of the wishes of the communities they serve. He hopes Xcel, with all the resources available, will find solutions that will benefit everyone. Everything he's been hearing at the meeting seems based on old technology. Mr. Conant stated that adult brain cancer caused the death of the person in the house next door. He has been one of those identified as likely caused by EMF by the California Study. This proposal also entails the expansion of the Roger's Lake substation, which is right next to a playground. This substation, as it exists now, is an immense emitter of magnetic fields, and will only become greater. Michael Black, 904 Mendakota Court Mr. Black lives next to the power line, as it passes approx. 100 feet from his house. Mr. Black wanted to discuss the topic of risk of litigation that hangs like a shadow over this entire process. Since the matter was first proposed in 1999, Mr. Black appeared before the Commission in February, 2000, and at that time, argued for the creation of a mechanism to have a regional review of this condition, because he thought it unfair for Mendota Heights to have to bear the brunt of the first decision. There were more cities that had interest in this, and he thought it would be wise to treat as a regional issue and to avoid the divide and conquer strategy that seems to have been taken by making the application here first. There was also a lack of information about the project at that time, as the Steering Committee was formed. If there is discussion, and exchange ideas, there has to be a way to have everyone get what they want out of this. A few years ago, Mr. Black believed a good solution was to permit the double circuiting. But to do something reasonable to minimize the health effects and the loss of property value that likely go with this line, he suggested the line be double circuited and be underground in the areas that pass within 100 feet of a residence. Another thing Mr. Black thought was received from the study was no litigation, because all three cities are concerned about the cost of defending themselves in the event of the district court challenge of the denial of the permit. He felt that the Steering Committee mechanism would be a way to avoid that, and come up with a solution. Not only has the City of Mendota Heights been sued and it appears that it's on the behalf of the Power Line Task Force; we got sued there before the City Council had a chance to make a decision. South St. Paul also got sued, and they made a decision to deny the permit flat out, but then reconsidered and permit the line be double circuited, but only if it's buried in these areas, but if the cost is passed onto the homeowners by the PUC, it will be denied. That solution probably hastened the litigation rather than holding it off. They ended up settling. It seems now that Mendota Heights must make the decision whether South St. Paul has underground or not. He feels that there probably will not be a solution that is going to 7 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 work short of granting the permit unconditionally, which is going to keep the City of Mendota Heights out of court. Mr. Black recommended that the City should make a position as if litigation were not a risk, as he thinks it's inevitable. He recently read a letter from a lawyer from Briggs and Morgan, who represents Xcel, that was sent to Sunfish Lake in which he told the City of Sunfish Lake that is was not permitted under state law for them as a city to do anything but to grant the permit application unconditionally or to deny it unconditionally. State law does not permit a public body to impose conditions on an application for a CUP, which people are surprised to hear that this is permitted under state law. The letter went on to say that the city was not free to ignore the advice received from CAI. He also said that the City of Sunfish Lake was without power to direct undergrounding and that the PUC would never do anything but order individual citizens to pay for the cost of undergrounding. It then seems, according to this letter, that the city has one choice ... to approve this application unconditionally, or the case will go to court. Mr. Black has concluded that Mendota Heights can expect legal action, which is inevitable. The only way to assure the opportunity is presented for a discussion of frank negotiation is to recommend denial of the permit and have the City Council deny the permit, and to let Xcel decide what legal action they want to take, or come back with a proposal that is more palatable to the Council and Commission. Mr. Conant developed a list of information and presented to City Attorney Hart. Scott Miller, 1021 Wagon Wheel Trail Mr. Miller has been in construction for over thirty years. A recent projection from the Met Council indicated that the population of the metro council would increase by one million people by the year 2030. He stated that this proposal may or may not be adequate to support the future population needs. Mr. Miller believes Xcel will, in the future, request additional lineage. Mr. Miller stated, "if you can't beat, get ahead of them ". As mentioned at the Tuesday meeting, the Planning Commission has an opportunity to make a statement to the global community. This Planning Commission should work with Xcel on underground power line systems for the following reasons: 1. Security, safety, and aesthetics. An underground system would be less vulnerable to sabotage, inclimate weather, and the power lines are just plain ugly. 2. EMF. An underground system re- routed along the freeway or highway removes the potential health hazard from residential areas. 3. Cost savings. The annual maintenance cost could be reduced by 25% - 75 %. An underground system would negate the need for tree trimming, pole replacement, and emergency repairs for knocked down lines due to storms. Future cost savings would also be realized by sizing the piping to accommodate power lines that will be needed in the future. With a little research, Xcel could accommodate pole lines, cable, and fiber optic networks in the same piping, and lease space to those companies. 8 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 Mr. Miller continued by saying if cables can be laid on the ocean floor to Europe, and Williams Pipeline can run an underground gasoline from Texas to Minnesota, and both of these systems can be monitored, why can't Xcel. It was mentioned that Xcel has proposed to do the work in the fall, winter, and spring. The most constantly time of the year to do construction is that time of the year. By running the system along the freeway, the work would be done in the summertime. Typically, this saves construction costs 10% to 30 %. The representative from Xcel gave a ballpark figure of approx. $17M to construct an underground system. What is the cost for Xcel to build this system? What does Xcel figure for maintenance costs per year? If the $17M project were proposed, using the average savings of 10% to 30% by doing it in the summertime, cost would drop down to about $14.5M. Has there ever been a figure for project costs? The actual cost to Mendota Heights should become known at that time. If the PUC determines that residents have to pay for it, Mr. Miller has no problems with that. He figures about $5 to $10 per month increase for individuals. As to reduce valuation of property by having overhead power lines, he personally believes that if they ran underground, the opposite would result and an increased value in property with an underground system would benefit the city with an increase in potential tax base. Chuck Gilbertson, 542 Huber Drive He expressed support for his neighbors that made presentations. Mr. David Callahan, Xcel Energy Response to general issues: ➢ Valuation of property. The existing line has a conductor on it that is capable of carrying 1,600 amps and there is an association to magnetic field. The reason for the double circuiting is to provide a parallel path so that there is redundancy so that if one of the lines fails, the remaining line can carry the total capacity of both conductors during an emergency situation. The conductor Xcel wants to put on has the second circuit, which is 1,600 amp conductor, so this splits the current equally on both conductors so that a line cannot carry more than 800 amps on either phase because if it was over 800 amps, the line trips out, and the conductor that rated at 1,600 amps would be carrying more than it's capable of carrying. As the density in the area reaches saturation, it will not be a straight -line projection. It will start to flatten out. Transmission systems aren't stabling as the systems grows, there will be additions to the system, not this specific portion, but further south, that will relieve the system of load to hold this conductor at approx. no more than 800 amps. The magnetic field will taper off to some degree and at some point be capped. ➢ Land value. Problem with HUD homes, homes cannot get loans from FHA & HUD because of the proximity to the transmissions lines. That may have been true last year, but HUD 9 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 revised the regulations. Copy was given to the Commissioners. It states that if a structure in not within the easement area, the rule does not apply. If Xcel Energy does not normally allow residents within our easements area, HUD does not permit the loan and the bank get a letter from the utilities stating that the building is not in within the fall distance of the structures holding up the transmissions lines. Chair Lorberbaum asked for clarification that the fall line is the distance from the pole to the house as compared the height of the pole. Mr. Callahan stated that was what HUD used to say. It just says the engineered fall distance. Nobody knows quite what this means because we don't engineer our lines to fall. He believes that the fall line is from the base of the pole, the height of pole if it tipped over. Chair Lorberbaum stated that in theory, Mr. Callahan is saying they get HUD approval if it's a 100 -foot pole if the pole is 100 feet from the house. Mr. Callahan stated it says only if the structure is within the easement. Since Xcel has a policy that doesn't allow houses within their easement, this is not normally their problem. There are cases where houses are within the easement and there is two houses by Dodd Road where the houses are partially on the easement, however, if they get a letter from the utilities saying that these structures, even though they are in the easement, are not within the fall line or engineered distance from the poles. The two houses in Mendota Heights that are encroaching on the easement are well far away from the two structures that hold up the line. They get a letter from the utilities that they are not within the fall lines and they get their loans. Chair Lorberbaum asked what the typical easement is of these lines. Mr. Callahan stated that the line is 50 feet, 25 feet on each side. He confirmed that these two houses are within the line, but not anywhere close to the structures holding the line. This is applying only to the structures supporting the line, not the centerline of the easement. They are well over 100 feet away from the structures that support the line, so even though they are within the easement, they still can obtain a letter saying that they are not within any fall distance of the structures and still get their FHA loan. As far as land value effect, when this line was installed in 1928, and NSP came along and purchased or obtained easement for this line, the landowners were paid at that time compensation to make them whole for the continuation of the value before the taking of the easement. Some landowners come and purchased the property from the previous owner. This is done with knowledge of the line and the easement because it's on the title, and they reach a market value price. The new owner is paying what they feel it's worth. This market value is transferred each time. In terms of the actual creation of the easement, the original landowners are compensated for the taking and every subsequent landowner pays and agrees to a market price. This also applies to the adjacent land owners who when they buy their homes, even though the line may not be on their property, can see the line and make a judgement as taking that into consideration. The CEI study from Colliers -Towle contains the information, it was not highlighted. They studied four areas and selected what they called subject houses in each area that were adjacent to the property line and then found comparable sales away from the line, adjusted the comparable 10 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 properties to make both seem equal. Area number 1, South St. Paul and the existing line, they found averaging the differences that the houses sold along the line sold for, an average, 1.4% more than the houses away from the lines. A possible explanation is that Xcel owns the right of way in South St. Paul and the neighbors there are allowed to use half the right of way as part of their yard at no cost or tax burden. The second area in the study is also along an existing line in Mendota Heights and there they found that the houses next to the line, on average, were diminished in value 1.3% from the houses away from the line. Area number 3 is in Brooklyn Park, by the Edinborough Golf Course area. It's very difficult to find neighborhoods with the exact same structures, but the lines in area 3 and 4 are double circuit steel 150 kV line that are the same as the ones proposed to be installed. The study found that the houses along the lines were devalued in the Edinborough area by 1.7% from the houses that were further away from the line. In Area Number 4, in Brooklyn Park, it was found that the houses away from the line were devalued by .4% on the average over the houses away from the line. The average between Area 1 and Area 2 showed the value of the houses actually .05% greater than the houses away from the line. Areas 3 and 4 averages were found to be 1.05% diminishing value than those away from the line. Betlej - is there a date on the study by Colliers Towle. (October 6, 2000) Betlej stated getting some information about studies that have been completed since talked about all the facts. Any influence on values since that time? Mr. Callahan stated he did not have that information, in Minnesota the Supreme Court ruling is that in terms of loss of value in appraising homes, it's just market value in terms of trying to attribute that to a specific cost is not the issue, looking at the comparables in the market data in trying to determine if there's a before and after value and in trying to attribute why that is to any particular or what percentages to any particular attributes, like in the eminent domain taking, you just go by the market data and they don't try to charge. Commissioner B. McManus stated that unless Xcel has two discrete separate numbers (ends), a valid comparison couldn't be made, as they may overlap. Mr. Callahan stated that it was asked of Xcel for comparison of the two types of lines, this report is the only one where it compares the two types of lines. The Commission can only look at the data and make a judgement as to whether they think it's valid. This was done by two certified appraisers. Commissioner M. McManus asked when the appraisals are done, are the done on a one point of time, is it done with a history, ownership turnover, how is it compiled. Mr. Callahan replied that actual sales data from the houses near the line and compared them to houses away from the line. They all did not occur at the same time, but when they adjusted the subject to the comparable house, one of the adjustments is a time adjustment. They use the market trends. Chair Lorberbaum asked if it were similar to someone who is trying to mortgage and house, or refinance it, someone comes to look at the house and try to find comparable homes that have been sold in the comparison. Mr. Callahan stated this was called a market comparison. 11 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 Commissioner M. McManus stated she was trying to get a sense of follow -up about the period of time when homeowners might be selling or buying before they get more information about the health impacts and concerns that might have been raised over a period of time. Commissioner Betlej stated it would be information as of the date of the appraisal report. Mr. Callahan stated that for every seller, there is a buyer. They are moving into the house at an agreed to market price, and that is what the market transaction price is. Commissioner Betlej stated that the point meaning that if there is new information comes out, that might affect the interaction between the buyers and sellers. Chair Lorberbaum asked for clarification of Class of Charge Level sheet that was given to the Commission. Mr. Callahan stated Xcel estimated burying the entire line within the City of Mendota Heights from Delaware Avenue through Roger's Lake, all the way to the west side of Highway 13. It is very difficult because of the lakes, which would require boring underneath. The incremental cost over the overhead lines is within $2M of the $10M that Mendota Heights would be charged to underground one circuit and $19M to underground both circuits. There have been tariffs that have been approved by the PUC for underground distribution and they cap these tariffs at $4.50 per month through residential customer or five year recovery. The five year residential monthly recovery, based upon the number of residential customers in Mendota Heights, with $10M, it's $37.00 per month. For $19M, it's $70.30 a month. The interest rate is 8 %. Commissioner Hesse asked where is the cost for the basic upgrade solution. Mr. Callahan stated it was $1.75M for the overhead line. That cost is covered by Xcel. Heidi Benedict, Environmental Analyst for Xcel Energy Ms. Benedict presented documents showing there is other studies done showing a 2- or 3- fold increase of childhood leukemia. The Minnesota Department of Health's letter, dated March 7, 2001, had reviewed two recent reports, and made an analysis entitled "Leukemia" and they felt that it did not represent any new data, but rather re- combining and re- analysis of data from selected studies that were previously published. They said that the authors pointed out there are many assumptions and limitations involved when combined and interpret data from different studies. Each of with has its own limitations, methodology, and exposure assessment and biases. On July 27, 2001, the Department of Health submitted another letter to the Power Line Task Force and the technical staff at that time reviewed EMF literature and the reviewed the current findings and concluded that the vast body of research done to date provides limited support that demonstrates that EMF causes leukemia or any other adverse health effects. There have been assumptions made that if you have reduction in melantonin that you are increasing your risk of breast cancer and that still has not been completely proven. Ms. Benedict stated this is a new area and a lot more research needs to be done. 12 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 There has been a lot of talk about two new studies that have come out from the State of California. She referred to page 11 of her presentation handout. Ms. Benedict stated that regarding the research, it's been extensively studied in the past thirty years, there is no conclusive evidence existing to support that exposure to EMF causes cancer or any other adverse health effects. Chair Lorberbaum called for five - minutes summarizations. Roger Conant ➢ The Colliers Towle study that was done, was hired by Xcel, and paid by Xcel. Provided in the Task Force's documents under Tab L a letter from Capital Appraisers which utilized the database that Tolliver Colle used and the owner of Capital Appraisers listed four reasons why the study was invalid. 1. The reduction of property values 2. Vancouver Study — did not examine houses that were anywhere near as close to the power lines as the houses in Mendota Heights 3. Supreme Court — lawyer's article regarding the fear of people on EMF is a legitimate fear 4. All studies the task force referred to were sponsored by government agencies David Callahan ➢ Xcel is a regulated utility and in regards to the EMF issue, this is reviewed by state agencies. ➢ Xcel Energy feels that these state agencies have preempted authority over this and absent any order from them, requiring restrictions of this line in regard to EMF, Xcel does not feel that they can pursue doing anything other than avoiding measures, they are reducing the EMF by more that 55% by double circuiting and refiguring the lines. COMMISSIONER BETLEJ MOVED, SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER HESSE, TO CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. 6 Ayes 0 Nays MOTION CARRIED Commission Summaries Chair Lorberbaum reminded the Commission that the City is to consider the effects of the proposed use on the health, safety, and welfare of the occupants of the surrounding land, and existing and anticipated traffic conditions, including parking facilities on adjacent streets, and the effect of the proposed use on the Comprehensive Plan. If the Council determines that the proposed use will not be detrimental to the health, safety, and general welfare of the community, nor will cause serious traffic congestion nor hazards nor will seriously depreciate the surrounding property values, and that the same is in harmony with the general purpose and intent of the 13 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 zoning ordinances and the Comprehensive Plan, the Council may grant the CUP imposing conditions and safeguards therein. Commissioner B. McManus ➢ Xcel provides a reasonable price for reliable power ➢ Xcel handles emergencies very well ➢ Commission B. McManus hopes that Heidi Benedict's analysis of the research on electromagnetic fields is right. And if we had nothing to worry about. However, there is a credible and growing and increasingly compelling body of knowledge within the recent several years that cause concerns for the health and safety of fellow citizens. ➢ Commissioner B. McManus comes from a behavioral science background, and in this field, one must rely on association, probability, level of confidence, and couldn't rely on statistical evidence to reach credible and comfortable levels of probability. ➢ He is concerned that EMF's are part of a cult for human beings to survive in enough quantity and enough proximity. ➢ He does not wish to live under or near a transmission line. He does not like the aesthetics of it. ➢ He thinks that it might be conventional wisdom, but he would not pay a lot of money to live there. He questions whether Mr. Callahan has been given a research -based study and if the others (opponents in the audience) are accurate, he doesn't know if Mr. Callahan was given research or propaganda. It's not Mr. Callahan's problem, it's the people who wrote it because if they can't define what's near to the line and what's far from the line to your satisfaction, you can't do it to his. ➢ He is concerned about property value reduction and there is probably some reality to that. ➢ He is concerned that somehow or other, Mendota Heights and their 208 homes, that Mendota Heights, in general, is being demanded by Xcel to tolerate and to host transmission lines largely necessary for the growth and power usage of Bloomington and the other surrounding areas. ➢ He thinks it's reasonable for the Commission to question whether the city should bear costs of ameliorating the problems associated with that alone without expecting some help from Xcel or from the other municipalities that are going to benefit from those transmission lines. ➢ While Xcel does a nice job, he believes in this case the Xcel is acting like other big companies, they know what they want to do, they want to do it as cheaply as possible, they have not been willing to during the hearing to even entertain or describe possible options to the proposal which they made. Commissioner B. McManus is going to vote to turn down their request and he would be happy as a citizen to sit here and hear again at a future time, how they would meet the city's needs as well as meeting their needs. Until that happens, his vote is no. Commissioner Betlej ➢ Commissioner Betlej thinks that it is none of the Commission's business to design this whole thing. As you look at Conditional Use Permits, conditions can be added and when conditions are added, that means to tweak it a bit. Either the Commission likes what in front of them or they don't. The suggestion to redesign this thing, he doesn't know if the Commission has the 14 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 scope of understanding of the ability, but do we know what we're causing? If the Commission is going to suggest something, it's going to be maybe some boundaries to be operating with, but not necessarily telling Xcel exactly what they have to do. ➢ The Commission was provided so much paper (information) from both sides of the issue, and it seems that everything seems to contradict each other. Commissioner Betlej did some research on the Internet, hoping for something more unbiased, but he found the same thing on the Internet. ➢ There is a thread that connects, and the we may not be able to grasp it all today, and a decision will be made that isn't for 2002, but for a long period of time. He stated he was a little nervous about make a decision without a lot of good conclusive information that is going to end of being something we will have to live with for a long time. ➢ In terms of value of the homes around here, this city has known over time what the value of new information can mean to the value of homes as over time we see the impact of growth in flights over the south end of time, and what that's meant to homes under the flight path here in Mendota Heights relative to values of homes that are in areas that are not impacted by airplane flights and the difference of the growth in value of those homes. He thinks that there is something as if this information becomes more credible, it's going to have a bigger impact on value of those homes that are impacted by these things. ➢ He really is not looking at cost as much in making this decision, maybe that's a little bit utopia in this decision, but he thinks that certain people in this audience might be thinking in terms of cost, but he thinks that as we look at alternatives, there might be other ways to finance this that isn't under a PUC mandate, there might be ways for the local governments to be able to think about this more creatively. He doesn't think the Commission should be making a decision that says this is too expensive and we should throw out some alternatives. ➢ One of the reasons why we kick this out to a larger governmental body is because it was something that we felt it was a bigger issue, more benefits that go beyond the city, and the solution is not going to be just Mendota Heights, and it still needs to have a collaborative solution and he hopes that Xcel would take the lead in bringing us to a collaborative solution rather than what seems we are trying an individual community by community decision. He is not sure this is a healthy way to bring resolution to this. Chair Lorberbaum ➢ Chair Lorberbaum expressed her thanks to everybody for the information, for the time spent on presentations in coming here. She is glad the Commission was given the study independent on who paid for it, and she is glad this came back before the Commission again to look at now that there is new information. ➢ She hoped that the information would be compelling on one side or another, but kept hearing conflicting information that the EMF's were a problem, and EMF's were not an issue. That we shouldn't worry about the base for it. That's not an issue because it can be spread to everyone, or it can't be spread because we're asking for it, or it can go on I -494, or that it can't. She kept hearing wrong information from both sides, and it comes down to where she feels the truth is. ➢ It's not a matter of whether the current line should be taken down, whether it's unsafe, because that is not the question being asked. Xcel is simply saying, "this is what we want to 15 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 do at this point ". And in fact, by the raising of the poles, Xcel is placing them farther from people. By raising the poles, and putting in a double circuit, Xcel is reducing the EMF. And that's fact. ➢ It's a question of "do we like that compared to the other information ". If it's a hazard, prudent avoidance, what do we do to minimize the effect? Are we unique to have that many homes near the power line so that it is a situation that whatever the outcome is, the increased cost can be spread to more users. ➢ It comes down to a lot of things, but bottom line, she read what was needed to consider, and from what was heard and read, it sounds like the property values in Mendota Heights will be negatively impacted by the change to what was proposed by the applicant. The Commission cannot approve something that would negatively impact property values. ➢ Whether or not Chair Lorberbaum believes that EMF is a hazard is not the issue. She cannot support it if it affects property values. She would not like to turn down the application, but would like to come up with a suggestion to positively solve the issue. ➢ She agrees with Commissioner Dolan's suggestion that no matter what happens, a system of monitoring should be put in place. She would like to see, if the application were approved, the Xcel would make best efforts to occasionally reposition a pole farther from people's homes if that's easy to do. Commissioner Hesse ➢ Commissioner Hesse has struggled immensely with this, even way before it was to come before the Commission. He has tried to keep up to speed with what Xcel has provided to the city. ➢ He thinks the best way to approach this is to take both sides and list their positives. ➢ Xcel side: - Not convinced there is a health risk because there is immense amount of information, and contradicting as well. That may have a lot to do with the level of understanding in reading papers and reports. - Don't believe moving the line is a solution. By doing that, the same problem will be created somewhere else. - He believes what Xcel is proposing will provide a major reduction in EMF in the area. - He believes it will be expensive to bury the lines as well as seeking other alternatives. - The power lines have been there forever, before the homes were there, and he has a hard time blaming the person who was there first. - He hasn't seen much compromise from the Power Line Task Force and he thinks it certainly has a lot to do with passion and the true belief, and there is a major health issue here. ➢ Other side: - Same thing, everything he reads is contradicted. - He is not convinced there is not a health risk. - He believes property values will decrease, and he knows he would not buy a house near power lines. - There was no compromise on Xcel's side. 16 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 ➢ After looking at all these issues, Commissioner Hesse wants to find a way to come up with some suggestions for compromise. He could vote to deny the permit unless some effort of compromise and some way of meeting both sides needs. He could approve it too, if that were the case. ➢ He is a person who likes to move ahead, get things done. There was nothing more he would have liked than to come up with some approval of a CUP with conditions attached to it that satisfied everybody. The more he listened to discussion, and the more he read, he believes in waiting for the right compromise. People have to start to work towards that. He agrees with Commission Betlej that the Commission does not have the expertise to offer any possible conditions to make this reasonable to both sides. ➢ Bottom line is that there is a middle ground here, but don't know what conditions to attach to it, but the only way to move it closer to a compromise is to put people back to the table, and the only way to do that is to deny the permit. Commissioner M. McManus ➢ Commissioner M. McManus is also a satisfied customer of Xcel. ➢ She also was a satisfied customer of a Minnesota Power and Light, a rural electric cooperative. ➢ She has experienced being with electricity for up to four days at a time, so she understands when someone wants their power on, and what it might mean in case of overload on the system and issues related to customer use and service. ➢ She appreciated all the time and effort put forth by the applicant and the Power Line Task Force. Also appreciated is the professional and respectful way that the issues have been presented. She is aware that at times, it can be very difficult to maintain a intellectual presentation when emotionally, it has some high level of interest and concern of personal impact. ➢ She is not convinced about the level of needs and the needs determination at this time. Is this a need for Mendota Heights, for the customers, or a larger system, which would be beyond the border of Mendota Heights, and other communities? While looking at numbers and where the growth might be, she is not sure the need is as expansive as was presented. ➢ She believes there are other ways to manage power use and consumption that residents have responsibility for. ➢ She believes there are other alternatives. ➢ There are a couple of areas important, such as health impacts as identified in the ordinance and what provides the framework for the decision - making. About what we might feel would be use that would not be detrimental to health and other things. Also of interest is the depreciation of property value, as well as serious health effects. ➢ As far as the health effects, it could be debated forever. Scientists make a living and get their interests served professionally by doing studies, and she reads a lot of studies on a lot of issues. While being is Duluth for some time, there was serious questions raised about taconite tailings in Silver Bay that were a result from the tailings from the taconite from reserve mining into Lake Superior. It reminded her of some of the debate going on in Mendota Heights, as what is the economical impact, about the people drinking the water, the big businesses that are providing economic support to the area. 17 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 ➢ Commissioner M. McManus stated she looks at this among other kinds of health situations and see that we make a determination based on what we choose to believe of which part of which study. And when you look at all the studies, you can say there are inconsistent findings, limited support, this is what the state health department state, she doesn't care if it's a national or international study, there is always going to be this debate. She believes the issue of determining health impacts and health effects from EMF are complete. She believes that data leaning toward, there is a negative and adverse health effect from EMF. ➢ Property devaluation — there are a lot of estimates. Common sense would tell someone that they would not want to live under a power line, don't want to buy a house under a power line, don't want to see a power line. There is no hard enough data that has been presented to show there are no detrimental effects. ➢ The alternatives have not been fully explored. There is room to move. She stated that Mr. Miller laid out a lot of different issues with alternatives. In the near future, we have to take a look at what our communities look like with electrical infrastructures. That is important because we have to look at a different way to build our communities, and she thinks there are different alternatives. It was said it was not necessarily our business to make such expansive change, but to either approve or deny the CUP. She is in favor to deny the CUP as presented. However, she thinks there are opportunities to come together and work on something that will be a benefit to the community of Mendota Heights, and maybe as Dr. Havas said, that the world is watching Mendota Heights and how the city views the impact of EMF, she thinks the world and maybe the close communities will look at the city and say as we've taken a giant step forward in terms, now is the time to make the change and how our communities look and power lines to be one of those steps to be taken. Commissioner Betlej stated he would make a motion but asked for clarification. Is anything being done in terms of the wetlands and critical areas permit today. Chair Lorberbaum stated it was her understanding that all three are part of the application. Director Danielson confirmed. COMMISSIONER BETLEJ MOVED, SECONDED BY COMMISSIONER B. McMANUS, TO RECOMMEND DENIAL OF THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT BASED ON THE LACK OF INFORMATION AS TO THE HEALTH AND SAFETY OF THE RESIDENTS, AS THERE IS A NEGATIVE AND ADVERSE EFFECTS ON HEALTH GENERATED FROM EMF ASSOCIATED WITH THE PROPOSED TOWERS, AND THE EXISTING TOWERS, AND BASED ON THE NEGATIVE MATERIAL EFFECT OF PROPERTY VALUES ALSO TO RECOMMEND DENIAL OF THE WETLANDS AND CRITICAL AREA PERMIT, BASED ON THE LACK OF INFORMATION PRESENTED TO MAKE A DECISION. Further Discussion City Attorney Hart asked if there has been established a catalog or index of the record before the Commission to base whatever action is to be taken tonight. He suggested this is something that should be done based on the minutes and transcription of the tape that we can gleen that from. Chair Lorberbaum stated it has not been from Commission. 18 Planning Commission Meeting January 24, 2002 Assistant Administrator Patrick Hollister stated this proposal is scheduled for appear before the Council on February 19th and by that evening, staff will have compiled a complete record of all documents submitted to date pertaining to this application. City Attorney made recommendation that this information be part of the package that's given to the City Council. 5 Ayes 0 Nays MOTION CARRIED COMMISSIONER BETLEJ MOVED, SECONDED BY TO ADJOURN THE MEETING AT 10:30 PM. 19