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2008-10-29 Airport Relations Commission Minutes2008-10-29 Airport Relations Commission Minutes.txt[1/25/2018 4:04:21 PM] CITY OF MENDOTA HEIGHTS DAKOTA COUNTY, MINNESOTA AIRPORT RELATIONS COMMISSION MINUTES October 29, 2008 The regular meeting of the Mendota Heights Airport Relations Commission was held on Wednesday, October 29, 2008, at 7:00 p.m., in the Large Conference Room at City Hall, 1101 Victoria Curve, Mendota Heights, Minnesota. The following Commissioners were present: Liz Petschel, Chair; Robin Ehrlich, Vice Chair; Bill Dunn, Joe Hennessy, Sally Lorberbaum, and David Sloan, Commissioners. Also present were: Rich Feely, Goodrich; Ultan Duggan, Councilmember; Jim Danielson, City Administrator; Jake Sedlacek, Assistant to the City Administrator; Tim Butell, chief pilot NWA; John Bergman, Apple Valley City Councilmember; and Amanda Staple, Recorder. Not Present: Lyle Odland, Commissioner. Approval of Minutes Commissioner Lorberbaum requested a correction to the minutes of September 10, 2008, on page two, first paragraph, it should state, no maps had been published “showing Visitation School...” She stated that on page two, the third paragraph, it should state, “…during development of properties in Mendota Heights.” She stated that on page three, the second to last paragraph, it should state, “...send a thank you note to the people for their attendance at the ARC meeting.” She stated that on page four, the first paragraph, it should state, “…three times larger than that of a 747.” A motion was made by Commissioner Sloan, seconded by Commissioner Dunn, to approve the minutes of the September 10, 2008, ARC meeting as submitted. The minutes were approved with abstention of Commissioner Sloan, who had been absent. Unfinished and New Business A. Introduction of Joe Hennessy. Not discussed. B. Presentation by Rich Feely on Aircraft Innovations. Commission Meeting – October 29, 2008 Mendota Heights Airport Relations Commission 2 Rich Feely, Goodrich, advised that he was present at the meeting as a private citizen and not a representative of Goodrich. He stated that he has been with his current company for 16 years and has a background in mechanical engineering. He stated that he currently works to develop new systems that would go onto an aircraft, ranging from air data systems to cabin pressure. He stated that on the Dreamliner passenger plane you would feel more comfortable on the plane because of the change in pressure and humidity. He explained that most planes today are made of aluminum compared to the composite 2008-10-29 Airport Relations Commission Minutes.txt[1/25/2018 4:04:21 PM] material that the new plane is made of, therefore giving the new plane the advantage of allowing more oxygen and humidity. He advised that the lighting systems on the plane would also simulate daylight according to the time zones that you travel through, and explained that it would be compressed but should help create the feeling of going through a day. He advised that this plane would also eliminate the need to travel through a hub, which would allow for more direct routes to Europe and Asia. He advised that the new plane is also amazingly quiet, and exceeds stage four engine requirements. Commissioner Ehrlich questioned how many of the planes Northwest would be buying. Rich Feely advised that 20 had been ordered with the option to buy another 20 planes. He advised that the plane is a true wide body, and would allow for a more spacious ride. Chair Petschel questioned what it would be like for pilots to fly the new plane. Tim Butell advised that the navigation system could not really be improved upon by much but stated that the cockpit would now be wireless, the lcd’s would produce less heat, the clarity of the screens would be improved, and GBAS would be installed. Rich Feely advised that in flight entertainment would also be installed on the new aircraft, including wireless internet and telephone service. Councilmember Duggan questioned how the change in the noise level occurred. Rich Feely advised that noise is because of the air being pushed through the blades at a high speed, along with the harmonics of the engine size. He explained that by changing the way the air flows through the engine, the speed of the blades, and use of composite material that absorbs the noise. Councilmember Duggan questioned if the change was based on fuel consumption or noise complaints. Rich Feely advised that it was not only for the increased fuel consumption and emission purposes but also for noise reduction. He stated that the engines at take off are very quiet. He thought that once people start to fly on these new planes there will be a push in the next decade to replace older planes with aircraft with the newer technology. He explained that airlines are currently getting rid of the older planes and would be then Commission Meeting – October 29, 2008 Mendota Heights Airport Relations Commission 3 keeping their newer planes. He explained that a larger plane could be made quieter than a small plane, because of the size of the engine being used. Tim Butell questioned if the same technology used in this engine could be made smaller and still maintain the quietness. Rich Feely thought that they would be able to make it smaller but did not think that it would be noticeably quieter than the engine that is already in place on a plane of that size. Commissioner Ehrlich questioned what the cost of the 787 would be. Rich Feely advised that the cost of the frame would be $160,000,000; two engines at $5,000,000 each for a total of $10,000,000; paint would be $800,000 to $1,000,000; and the interior would cost varying amounts because it is completely custom. He advised that Boeing has a class of jets that people fly as business jets, and explained that the interior could have anything from a hotel suit to a conference room installed. Commissioner Lorberbaum questioned if the plastic material was lighter. 2008-10-29 Airport Relations Commission Minutes.txt[1/25/2018 4:04:21 PM] Rich Feely confirmed that the composite material is lighter, and has been used on military planes for the past 20 years. He advised that you could pound on the shell with a hammer and you would not be able to even dent the exterior. He advised that the difference in the weight of the plane also allows for less fuel consumption, probably 30% less. Commissioner Dunn stated that some problems had occurred during the assembly portion of the project. Rich Feely advised that the gluing together of the sections had been a problem at one time. Chair Petschel questioned if there was anything in terms of safety and security that makes it better in those areas. Rich Feely advised that a lot of those things are specific to the airlines. He stated that there is nothing that would be new to this aircraft that you could not have on other aircrafts. He explained that the interior is completely custom and anything could be added. Commissioner Lorberbaum questioned what the competition to this plane would be. Rich Feely advised that the 787 would be in flight within the next year, with a backlog going into 2013. He advised that the response from airbus was not to respond and instead were going to develop the A350. He explained that they felt it would be more beneficial to go this route than to try to develop a similar version of the 787. He advised that with the 787 an airline could buy two 787s and run two routes to the same location rather than sending an A380 at half capacity. Commission Meeting – October 29, 2008 Mendota Heights Airport Relations Commission 4 Chair Petschel questioned if an A380 could fly out of here with full capacity. Rich Feely advised that it could not, and explained that a modification would need to be made in order to allow that. Councilmember Duggan questioned if there would be any way that personal wireless devices used on board the plane would be able to jam the pilot’s ability to navigate. Rich Feely advised that would not be possible. He advised that the real reason you are not able to use a cellular telephone on a plane is because it does not know which cell tower to use from the ground and bounces around between several towers. He then displayed a video on the 787 and its production and testing. Chair Petschel questioned who would handle the maintenance of the 787. Tim Butell advised that most likely it would be the manufacturer but it would depend on the airline. Rich Feely stated that the real trend in aerospace is in the air taxi category, which would hold about six to ten passengers. He advised that it allows for business travelers to fly into and out of small airports on small planes, similar to a charter but for small groups of flyers. He advised that the benefit would be service similar to that of a taxi and the omission of having to check into a large airport and go through security. He advised that this type of plane is already in backlog. Commissioner Lorberbaum questioned if that trend would cause problems in the corridor. 2008-10-29 Airport Relations Commission Minutes.txt[1/25/2018 4:04:21 PM] Chair Petschel explained that they have already had problems with the regional planes staying in the corridor and advised that they would need to stay vigilant in their efforts. Commissioner Hennessy advised that this type of plane has a quieter engine and would be allowed to fly over homes, similar to a private jet. Councilmember Duggan questioned if different types of fuel is used on the different types of planes and how the airport would know to provide that fuel. Tim Butell advised that the planes take a generic type of fuel and explained that the pilots would not fly into an airport that did not have their specific type of fuel. He explained that the navigation systems in place help to keep the planes flying a trac as opposed to a heading. Chair Petschel thanked Rich Feely and Tim Butell for attending the meeting tonight and providing the Commission with the information that they had wanted to learn more about. Commission Meeting – October 29, 2008 Mendota Heights Airport Relations Commission 5 Rich Feely advised that more information could be found on the website, www.boeing.com. Commissioner Ehrlich questioned what causes a pilot to go off track. Tim Butell advised that the wind is increased at higher altitudes and could push a plane off track. He explained that pilots would hold a heading rather than a path, and advised that the new technology, RNAV, would help to correct for the wind. Commissioner Hennessy advised that there is going to be a transition period while the airlines switch to that technology. He advised that some pilots will be flying with RNAV while others are still using the old technology. Tim Butell advised that there would be a trial period and stated that Northwest is the first airline to conduct the trial. He thought that the addition of Chair Petschel and Councilmember Duggan to the NOC has been a great benefit and has also helped to develop relationships between the different Commissions. C. Update on Cities Meetings. Chair advised that she would like to table this issue until the December meeting. D. Updates for Introduction Book None. Acknowledge Receipt of Various Reports/Correspondence A. Correspondence from MAC dated 9-19-08 & 10-17-08 B. August 2008 ANOM Technical Advisor’s Report C. August 2008 ANOM Eagan/Mendota Heights Departure Corridor Analysis D. Airport Noise Report, September 5, 2008 E. Airport Noise Report, September 12, 2008 F. Airport Noise Report, September 19, 2008 G. Airport Noise Report, September 26, 2008 H. Airport Noise Report, October 3, 2008 I. Airport Noise Report, October 10, 2008 J. Airport Noise Report, October 17, 2008 2008-10-29 Airport Relations Commission Minutes.txt[1/25/2018 4:04:21 PM] Other Commission Comments or Concerns None. Commission Meeting – October 29, 2008 Mendota Heights Airport Relations Commission 6 Upcoming Meetings • MAC Meeting – November 17, 2008 – 1:00 p.m. • City Council Meeting – November 4, 2008 – 8:30 p.m. • NOC Meeting – November 19, 2008 – 1:30 p.m. • Planning Commission – November 25, 2008 – 7:00 p.m. Public Comments None. Adjourn A motion was made by Commissioner Sloan, seconded by Commissioner Dunn, to adjourn the meeting at 8:30 p.m. It was approved unanimously. Respectfully submitted, Amanda Staple TimeSaver Off Site Secretarial, Inc.